Author Topic: Lifting restrictions by Fiz from UK site  (Read 2980 times)

Sunny Clouds

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Re: Lifting restrictions by Fiz from UK site
« Reply #60 on: 23 Jul 2021 11:43AM »
Quote
You couldn't make it up.
Most people wouldn't try, but Boris does.


I don't see a difference, behaviourally, between this and the famous story told by his old schoolmasters (which I probably refer to too often) of when he didn't bother to learn his lines for a play but just stuck them on the back of things where he could read them.

The difficulty with all this, as has been illustrated nicely on Ouchtoo in recent conversations, is that it's effectively impossible to know what's deliberate and what's not.
(I'm an obsessive problem-solver, so feel free to ignore any suggestions or solutions I offer, even if they sound terribly insistent.)

Fiz

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Re: Lifting restrictions by Fiz from UK site
« Reply #61 on: 23 Jul 2021 01:29PM »
I think (as well as being a liar kudos to the labour MP thrown out of the commons yesterday for refusing to take back her statement about Boris being a liar) I think he's a bumbling idiot. I think he genuinely believed that the only way to keep this pandemic at controllable levels was for everybody pinged to self isolate so he said what he thought was necessary. Hours later he realised shops had no food in due to lack of deliveries, panic buying was starting and the situation with lack of deliveries with numbers isolating rising the situation was unintenable so he had to backtrack. Someone with more intelligence would have seen this coming as numbers have been steadily rising for weeks and other industries have had to close due to lack of staff so the fact this shocked him is shockingly poor foresight on his part. Clown.

Sunny Clouds

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Re: Lifting restrictions by Fiz from UK site
« Reply #62 on: 23 Jul 2021 02:01PM »
It frightens me that he is a clown.

The more I ruminate (depressively) on international history, the more I reach the conclusion that a comment made on here in response to something I said is very pertinent to many leaderships.

We were discussing Hitler and the rise and development of Nazism, my pet topic on that being that it developed and changed rather than suddenly being as portrayed in film, and then someone (sorry don't remember who) commented on how influential others around Hitler were.

Hitler was a bit of a 'character'.  That WW1 moustache, already out of date by the time he got into power.  His ridiculous barking fake Prussian accent.   A useful front man.

Would Boris be in power if he wasn't such a useful front man?  He clowns around, bumbles around, not doing his homework, just winging it, drawing the focus of the journalists and commentators, whilst the hardcore neoliberal moneystrippers get on with what they want to do.

I was chatting yesterday with someone who's recently escaped from Hong Kong.  I thought we're some way off from Chinese dictatorship, but we won't be if we don't keep spreading the warnings and promoting community spirit and reminding people that it matters to care about things like the welfare state and vulnerable people.
(I'm an obsessive problem-solver, so feel free to ignore any suggestions or solutions I offer, even if they sound terribly insistent.)

Fiz

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Re: Lifting restrictions by Fiz from UK site
« Reply #63 on: 27 Jul 2021 07:44AM »
I'm a bit puzzled by the BBC news currently. It talks of Covid cases plummeting but I check all 15-20 areas in my county's numbers every weekday and although numbers haven't risen, they're certainly not dropping. Maybe my county is unique! 

The case numbers are also higher than any other time in the pandemic. But I am reliably informed there are no Covid patients in ICU in the county which is encouraging. Overall, an encouraging picture but I shall remain more or less shielding for a while longer. 

Are your area's numbers falling?

Sunny Clouds

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Re: Lifting restrictions by Fiz from UK site
« Reply #64 on: 27 Jul 2021 08:45AM »
I don't know whether my area's cases are falling or rising, but there will be difficulties with statistics, depending on what they show.

Possible problems with statistics or what they may not clearly show, bearing in mind that politicians, journalists etc. may not make them clear...

1. Whether they're based on numbers of deaths, numbers of people testing positive/negative, numbers of people hospitalised etc.

2. Whether, if based on cases, they include any estimate of symptomless cases, of milder cases that may be mistaken for nasty flu (but which could lead to long covid), or of people hiding mild cases because they can't afford to isolate.

3. Whether they take into account false negatives on tests.

4. Whether they clearly indicate delay between infection and symptoms, particularly where mild initial illness is followed by long covid.

I'm very sure others could think of other potential issues with the statistics.
(I'm an obsessive problem-solver, so feel free to ignore any suggestions or solutions I offer, even if they sound terribly insistent.)

Sunny Clouds

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Re: Lifting restrictions by Fiz from UK site
« Reply #65 on: 27 Jul 2021 08:54AM »
As may be evident from various posts I've made, I feel particularly strongly about long covid, and I'm unhappy that it doesn't seem to be mentioned much in terms of statistics. 

My bias includes having had postviral fatigue more than once.  The second time I am sure that I had it, I was at that point in the clutches of my local dysfunctional mental health services, so it was dismissed as retarded depression.  That meant I didn't get the help I needed.

So I have for many years felt empathy for those with the range of conditions that I believe to be connected with fatigue and/or generalised pain and who are dismissed as variously imagining it, faking it, not making an effort to get better or whatever.  I am very concerned that this will happen to people with long covid, but cling onto hope that the co-ordinated long covid sufferers' movement may bring about some really positive changes in respect of treatment of not just long covid but a whole range of conditions.

Thus I'm grumbly to say the least about the emphasis on death.  Putting it bluntly, there will be people with long covid who will wish they'd died quickly if they get as little support as people with a range of other disabling conditions.
(I'm an obsessive problem-solver, so feel free to ignore any suggestions or solutions I offer, even if they sound terribly insistent.)

oldtone27

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Re: Lifting restrictions by Fiz from UK site
« Reply #66 on: 27 Jul 2021 08:56AM »
One further reason is how many tests are carried out. In extremis no tests, no cases.

Several commentators are pointing out that school testing will have reduced due to closure for the summer holidays, It is also possible that people, even with symptoms, are not testing to avoid isolating. Lack of pay being a prime concern.

Of course it could be that vaccination is finally having an effect but I think we are going to have to watch a few weeks results yet to see if there is a real trend.

Fiz

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Re: Lifting restrictions by Fiz from UK site
« Reply #67 on: 27 Jul 2021 10:02AM »
Sunny, the numbers are the amount of people testing positive for Covid. 

Oldtone you make very valid points about the variables, the most important one that I hadn't thought of is that senior school pupils have all been having weekly lateral flow tests and schools have broken up for "summer" so a massive drop in the numbers of tests being carried out which will of course cause a drop in positive cases identified. Lateral flow tests frequently throw up false negatives of course so numbers were likely to be higher than numbers quoted. I guess therefore, we won't see a real picture of how we're doing case wise until schools go back in September!

Sunny Clouds

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Re: Lifting restrictions by Fiz from UK site
« Reply #68 on: 27 Jul 2021 10:23AM »
I don't watch the BBC at all unless I find a direct link elsewhere to something or find their stuff on youtube.  I don't bother with iplayer.  As I scroll, there are pictures that flash back and forth between pictures and words.  There's no non-flashing version or text only version.  For years, I parked my television at someone else's house and didn't even bother with a television licence. 

Early in the pandemic, I tried watching BBC stuff about it on youtube, but Johnson and his mob just rambled impenetrably.   But then I don't use the website for news unless there's a reference to it elsewhere.  Trying to find any info at all requires click, click, click. 

I just tried to find out that info about local cases and had to scroll past various stories with big pictures and small print about stories about youtubers and partying and pregnancy and holidaying.  It all looks like the front page of a red-top and therefore not worth reading.

I finally worked out that I had to click on the thing about how many cases had been reported and found my screen filled with a picture of people on a train, with the focus on a woman with a low-cut top.  I don't expect to find anything serious at all in an article that starts like that.   It's not prudishness about bodies, it's an expectation of the sort of story, classic red-top news focus.

Why would I expect to find anything serious on that page? 

You may say that that's just me, but I'm not alone in my attitude to such things.
(I'm an obsessive problem-solver, so feel free to ignore any suggestions or solutions I offer, even if they sound terribly insistent.)

Sunny Clouds

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Re: Lifting restrictions by Fiz from UK site
« Reply #69 on: 27 Jul 2021 10:51AM »
Sorry, I've gone off on a tangent there.

It's just that I'm fed up with the way we are or aren't given information and statistics by the government.

During the pandemic, I've relied on my local Reach group website.  Their journalists or interns seem to find the quickest way to make clickbait is to extract information from elsewhere, and that includes summarising national and local government information.

That is not a criticism of anyone here citing government statistics.  It's just a wail about how I've given up trying to digest them from government briefings and from the BBC.
(I'm an obsessive problem-solver, so feel free to ignore any suggestions or solutions I offer, even if they sound terribly insistent.)

Fiz

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Re: Lifting restrictions by Fiz from UK site
« Reply #70 on: 27 Jul 2021 02:03PM »
I don't have a TV licence so don't watch BBC or iPlayer etc

To find your local rates will require a few clicks. From the BBC news website click on England then from there by clicking on England (or hovering over it I can't remember) it says "regions" from the region's news page you can put in your town and it should then list the daily positive Covid tests for each region in your county. These statistics are accurate results from all PCR and lateral flow tests. They only provide results daily Monday to Friday so the weekend's results are included in Monday's so that is always the highest results day.

Just had my legs waxed and the therapist who has senior school age children told me that children have discovered that orange juice creates two lines on the lateral flow tests which is a positive Covid result which was giving children and their bubbles and their teachers time off isolating so it appears that we may have experienced a high number of Covid cases due to orange juice.

Eta it's not regions you should choose from the England drop down menu, it's "local news" then type in your town. As of today my area of the county's numbers have dropped but my nearby city has risen sharply. That city has always had high numbers due to restricted workplaces and high number of multi occupancy housing. Hence not visiting the city to shop - long time.
« Last Edit: 27 Jul 2021 02:11PM by Fiz »

Sunny Clouds

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Re: Lifting restrictions by Fiz from UK site
« Reply #71 on: 27 Jul 2021 04:03PM »
I wasn't looking at the England menu, I was looking at the coronavirus menu.

I think that sums up for me why I don't make much use of the BBC site.  You shouldn't need to play "Guess what heading it's under" to find stuff.

That being said, I have just tried doing what you said.  I can't find a heading for it for my local area. There are articles about a range of repetitive topics that probably tell us very little that's new - rough sleeping, public transport, problems with council services, sport, seasonal & religious stuff.  There's one article about a local hospital and coronavirus figures, which could be summed up in a single sentence "Doctors at local hospital say you're more likely to get covid-19 if you haven't had the vaccine." 

The only other stuff I can find on coronavirus is a band across the screen lower down with a few general information articles that are the same as on the front screen, with no statistics that I can find unless they've got a completely irrelevant heading.

Never mind, if I scroll down, I can find lots more sport alternating with seasonal photography. 

I wonder whether you're viewing it in a different format.

This is not a criticism of you, just of the inaccessibility of the BBC.  I've tried to find a version without all the images, but they don't do one.  Massive images, most of which seem irrelevant to the story, and tiny font.  My brain doesn't do it.
(I'm an obsessive problem-solver, so feel free to ignore any suggestions or solutions I offer, even if they sound terribly insistent.)

Fiz

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Re: Lifting restrictions by Fiz from UK site
« Reply #72 on: 27 Jul 2021 06:06PM »
If you send me your town name in a pm I will send you the direct link so you can see your numbers in your county

Sunny Clouds

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Re: Lifting restrictions by Fiz from UK site
« Reply #73 on: 27 Jul 2021 06:44PM »
I'll do that in a bit so you can show me the link.

That being said, I'm not convinced the BBC will be a good source.  I shouldn't need to keep a link to the relevant page of the BBC to find stuff.  These are some of the easy-access sources I use:-

Guardian.  Homepage.  Series of options by drop-down menu.  Default home page is 'news', which is left-hand drop-down.

Fourth drop-down across 'coronavirus'.

First two options top left are world map and UK map.

UK map, found by just two quick clicks without scrolling shows clearly laid out data with charts and figures.

Local area option is clear, albeit low down and requiring scrolling.

Sky news give a clear, brief summary of daily case totals nationally on youtube.  Their site has the current national info as main headline news.  It's usually not far down.

My local community group does a homepage link to our council's weekly news.

Once there, the first sentence offers two links, the first to general info and the second to a pdf of weekly data, which has a large, clear diagram with numbers for four different ways of presenting the current  

The council's info includes weekly breakdown, with an initial large diagram with numbers for the city presented in four different sorts of ways of presenting the figures.

If you scroll, there are some charts, including more detailed figures by ward.


I used to consider the BBC a good source of info, but  now it's almost as impenetrable as Boris's waffle.  I used to think it was just me that felt this way about government and BBC info, but too many others now have told me they feel likewise.

Oh well, the rain seems to have stopped.  I shall don my mask and head down to a local shop to practise my 'social disancing reel' and 'distanced supermarket aisle waltz'.

Sorry to be so non-stop whingey about everything to do with the government's handling of the pandemic.  I need to take a deep breath and get less heated about it.
(I'm an obsessive problem-solver, so feel free to ignore any suggestions or solutions I offer, even if they sound terribly insistent.)

Fiz

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Re: Lifting restrictions by Fiz from UK site
« Reply #74 on: 28 Jul 2021 12:37PM »
Your area appears to be completely different sunny, nothing on the BBC local area or regions pages at all about Covid rates in your area! You appear to have a very low uptake on the vaccine there though which would concern me if I went out and about. There is a link to a Reach page citing Covid rates but that only gave weekly rates rather than daily with the last date being 23rd July. Already in my area today's rates have been published for yesterday's tests for my county. Weird that each area provides different information via the BBC. 

I'm not a Reach fan personally, everytime you visit their website you have to object to cookies then click legitimate interest and object all there too before proceeding. Most websites only expect you to object to all their many information gathering cookies on your first visit but Reach is a rigmarole per visit.so often when a link leads me to Reach, I click out again.