Ouch Too

Forum => Health and Disability => Topic started by: JLR2 on 24 Feb 2021 07:27AM

Title: Covid jab
Post by: JLR2 on 24 Feb 2021 07:27AM
Had a call from my GP's surgery and asked if I'd like to pop down for my share of Astra Zeneca, so 10 to 12 today and I'll have a sore arm :f_smiley:
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Sunshine Meadows on 24 Feb 2021 04:37PM
JLR,

Sorry about your sore arm.

Mr Sunshine had his vaccination today he thinks it was the Pfizer one, I would need to check the paperwork to know.
He was more bothered about having to wait for ten minutes after he had the vaccination than anything else.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: JLR2 on 24 Feb 2021 05:10PM
Hi Sunshine, had my vaccine and so far no sore arm. I arrived within a moment or so of the arranged time and in/out in a couple of minutes. I sat in the car and then went off to do a quick bit of shopping. Talking of shopping that bit of shopping I did buying the gammon from my local butcher really has proved worth it for me. The butcher let me bone and roll my ham in the shop and then use their flatbed Berkel slicer to slice it. The difference in the quality of rashers of gammon compared to the back bacon (sweetcure) is just great. Between the taste and the much reduced water content of the gammon sees me not having to scape the salt deposits of the rashers as they fry.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Sunshine Meadows on 25 Feb 2021 05:17PM
JLR,

Thank is great  :thumbsup:

(How long does the gammon keep for?)
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: KizzyKazaer on 25 Feb 2021 09:09PM
Dare I ask how old you are, JLR?  I had a bit of a surprise on Tuesday when my medical practice phoned to say I was on the list for a Covid jab and they had a slot this Friday (tomorrow!)  As I am 'only' 54, I couldn't understand why I was being called up so early:  I mean, I know the vaccination programme is ahead of schedule but hadn't anticipated hearing anything myself until at least the back-end of March....

Not that I'm going to 'look the gift horse in the mouth', of course!
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Fiz on 26 Feb 2021 05:49PM
I had my first dose on January 30th so second dose is due in April. I was in group four being CEV due to unstable adrenal insufficiency. I only had a sore arm as it was the Pfizer I had. That seems to be common with the Pfizer. No other symptoms. My daughter should have her second Pfizer in March ready to return to work when her maternity leave ends. 

Hope yours goes okay kizzy.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: JLR2 on 26 Feb 2021 09:32PM
Hi Sunshine, the gammon will last the best part of a year, I've added the vacuum packing device I found in a Lidl store to my kitchen gadgets so I've used it to pack the numerous stacks of sliced gammon (including some gammon steaks)  and stored them in the freezer. The ham shank will be fine for making soup later this week.

Kizzy I'll be 70  in 7 years so not long now. It was the AstraZeneca vaccine which has my friend in Berlin a touch concerned because of the decision of the German government to restrict that vaccine to those under 65. My friend's also concerned about how we will cope if by the time I get over to Berlin she has not had a vaccination jab and going by the news coming out of Germany it could easily be September before she is invited for vaccination. There is a bit of me hoping that my flight will be cancelled just so I can claim a cash refund as the voucher I had was preventing the airline from making such a refund and had an expiry date in April.

As things stand I don't know what restrictions there will be in Germany come July when I'm due to fly out there and in a similar sense I don't know what the rules will be here in the UK come August when I'd be hoping to return home, I certainly couldn't afford to stop in a quarantine hotel.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Fiz on 27 Feb 2021 12:53PM
I'm assuming that "all legal restrictions will be lifted on June 21st" if conditions are met means that quarantine will end then as that's a legal restriction. So if the conditions are met you should be fine to fly, British laws wise.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: JLR2 on 27 Feb 2021 07:14PM
"British laws wise"

Aye but Fiz we've Nicola Sturgeon running things up here and depending on which way the winds blowing in her circle of nut jobs at the top of what was once a strong party for Scottish Independence she might just decide that only those who are of a transgender nature or worship the very ground she walks on are to be allowed to travel.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: KizzyKazaer on 02 Mar 2021 11:55AM
So you're 63, JLR (see how good my maths is :f_winkeye: )  I think the over-60s are being targeted for jabs next, so you're not far off schedule...

Fiz, mine went fine, just an achey arm during the evening.  I half-expected a headache, but none forthcame;  have read that the Pfizer jab is believed to have less side-effects, so maybe that's why I got off lightly :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: oldtone27 on 02 Mar 2021 12:50PM
We were discussing this topic on our VI group's zoom meeting this morning. Many of the members have now had their first jab. I reckon about half have had no after affects and most of the rest only mild ones such as a sore arm or a day so feeling off colour.

Only one had a bad reaction feeling really unsteady and sick for a couple of days followed three furthers days feeling poorly. Recovered now.

As far a I can tell neither vaccine seems cause more side effects I think it is much more dependant on individual reactions.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: JLR2 on 03 Mar 2021 07:37AM
Aye Kizzy, I'm of the Summer 58 vintage :f_smiley:   I've been a bit lazy this morning that's me just up and have the coffee making its way through the filters.

I don't know if it is just me but I'm getting a feeling bordering on automation in my habits, from waking to going to bed. It's like I'm living on repeat in the same way that a record player will play repeatedly a record on the turntable. Once I've filled the coffee machine (1.8ltr) I fetch the filter into place followed by the grinding of the beans then having put them into the machine scrub out the wee milk jug and rinse out my coffee mug before filling them with milk. The coffee mug of milk is to have when on reaching my couch in the living room I'll take my vitamin D tablet. The routine in the living room is again pure automation, I use one remote control to trigger a separate device, my German satellite box before I use the same remote to turn on my UK device and then the telly. I manually (press a wee button) on the audio connection and then it's off to fetch the coffee and as I sit here right now I know that apart from the date changing as tomorrow arrives it'll be no different.

Having said all that is it any wonder I'm looking forward to going over to Berlin come July?
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: SteveX on 03 Mar 2021 09:43PM
My doctors texted me today, saying I can now book my covid vaccine injection.  quite frankly I'm on the fence and not sure if I will.
Don't get my wrong, I'm not one of the anti vax silly people, I just think at my age and with all my problems it would be wasted on me and better used on someone who needs it more.   
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: JLR2 on 04 Mar 2021 06:39AM
Good morning Steve, I would encourage your taking the appointment as apart from helping yourself should you catch the virus according to some of what I've heard, from time to time, on the news the vaccine does have an impact on the spread of the virus to others.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: oldtone27 on 04 Mar 2021 09:00AM
I agree with JLR. Also you don't need to be concerned about depriving someone else of a jab. They are not being rationed. Only scheduled so that supply can keep up with demand. The worst you can do by having a jab is to delay someone else a day or two.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: ditchdwellers on 04 Mar 2021 11:02AM
Absolutely! Steve, I am in complete agreement with JLR2 and Oldtone. Everyone is entitled to get their jab and their turn will come. I'm having my first jab tomorrow after having had to postpone it from January. 
Of course it's your choice, but I would hate for you to miss out due to some misplaced sense of self sacrifice.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Fiz on 05 Mar 2021 03:03PM
I'd have the vaccine Steve, you'll be helping to protect your Mum and the soonest done the sooner you can be visiting again and having your takeaway. But you should do it for you too, you're worth it. Our worth is not measurable, it just is.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: KizzyKazaer on 05 Mar 2021 09:25PM
C'mon Steve, you're being a bit daft about this vaccine thing - roll up your sleeve and take it like a man :f_winkeye:
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Frances on 09 Mar 2021 03:15PM
I am Confused. Ryan had first Jab at Local Dr end Jan, I had to go on a trip in a Taxi 24 miles each way .
We both had different makes. Now I have just had an ap for the next one after only  5 weeks
I rang up and said thats early they said 5 weeks is fine,
Now this apt is in a different town 25 miles away. I explained The trouble I have getting in and out of Cars and walking ,
Then I get told they will do a home visit , Good to know!!!,
Why when I asked last time they said no.
I have 9 steps up to the road and as we are no longer allowed to sit in front of Taxi I had to crawl in the back.
Oh says she  ring this number and your local nurse will do It. (Scream !!)
Oh and Ry had one make and I had the other, By the way except for a sore arm no side efffects. :f_doh:
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: KizzyKazaer on 09 Mar 2021 07:44PM
So you should have a home visit, Frances, can't understand either why this wasn't offered first time round!

I suppose what determines which vaccine is given and to whom, is availability and current stock situation at the time - with the Pfizer make, my understanding is that the doses have to be all used up within a given timeframe because of the difficulty in storing it...

At least both you and Ryan have your first doses under your belts (or rather, up your sleeves :f_smiley: )
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Sunshine Meadows on 18 Mar 2021 04:23PM
Frances,

:big_hugs: I hope things go much better for your second dose.


I had a very different experience today, the medical centre I went to is nearby but not my GPs so I was worried about getting lost in a bigger building. There was a security guard at the entrance that asked questions like had we had any Covid symptoms then asked us to use hand sanitizer. Mr Sunshine left to go wait in the car and a lovely lady asked if she could help then pushed me to reception, we got the paperwork then lady 2 pushed me down a corridor and into a room and asked the bloke in the room to give her a shout when she could wheel me back. The bloke was lovely and reassuring, asked questions about allergies etc. The injection itself was painless and afterwards he offered to push me to the car park yes please and that is what he did.

Steve,

If you book the appointment anyway and then decide if you are able to go on the day you might surprise yourself. Booking via my GP texted link  gave me the option to go somewhere local whereas booking from the general NHS website link of click here (https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/coronavirus-covid-19/coronavirus-vaccination/book-coronavirus-vaccination/)



:big_hugs: :big_hugs: :big_hugs: for everyone who is struggling with this and also anyone in need of hugs at the moment.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Fiz on 22 Mar 2021 06:27AM
Glad it all went so well Sunny. 

I shall be glad to get my second one done late April. Shielding ends in 7 days time which feels weird as I will have been shielding a year tomorrow I think. Supermarkets are known to be a source of Covid spread so I will continue to get my shopping online fortnightly but I may try and pick up my own prescriptions onc shielding ends because the super volunteers in my town's Facebook isolation group really do deserve some rest. I would have been lost without them over the last year. There are a lot of good people out there helping people.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: ditchdwellers on 25 May 2021 04:39PM
I went to get my second jab and it all became quite interesting! 

My first one, Astra Zeneca,  had me throwing up in the car on the way home. I wasn't asked to wait after the jab and left straight away to come home. Fortunately, I always have sick bags in my bag so I didn't make a mess of my carers car  :f_laugh: 
It's less than a 10min drive from home to the vaccine point. Excruciating headaches followed for a couple of days. 

So this time around, I mentioned my side effects and all the doctors there went into a huddle. Looked at my med list and list of my conditions and then told me that I was too high risk to have the jab in the Parish Hall! They filled in a form and said that I probably had an allergic reaction to the vaccine so needed to have the second one under controlled conditions in hospital. I'm now waiting for a date. 
Why do I have to make life so complicated for myself?  :f_erm:
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Fiz on 26 May 2021 06:40PM
Wowsers! But I am pleased that they're taking good care of you.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: suessad on 05 Jun 2021 07:10PM
I sat on the fence for a while, as both my sons went down with flu for 5 days after.
As I was still trying to make my mind up NHS sent me a letter stating  ''I was Immunosuppressed and the jab would have little effect for me ''
 { Immunosuppression is the state in which your immune system is not functioning as well as it should. Immunosuppression can be caused by certain diseases but can also be induced by medications that suppress the immune system. Some medical procedures can also cause immunosuppression. }
 Was an eye opener, no-one had told me this before. Yes a few tears of self pity. Guess it didn't help being stuck indoors so long.
My weekly joy was granddaughter,  once a week standing in the front garden talking to me while I stood by open window.
So please don't condemn those who don't ...
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Fiz on 06 Jun 2021 08:44AM
I wouldn't condemn anyone for choosing not to have the vaccine let alone someone who can't have it for medical reasons. I do hope that it is never compulsory though I do understand that there may be circumstances when some employers night insist on it for protection of others. Many immunosuppressed people with adrenal insufficiency have chosen to have the vaccine anyway although it's unknown how much protection they'll gain from it. It should be personal choice. 

My son is stalling on booking his because he's terrified of needles! I'm unsure whether he will get past that fear.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Sunshine Meadows on 06 Jun 2021 04:45PM
I had my second jab last week and was okay until two days later when I felt like carp. It seemed to me it had triggered Menieres symptoms of dizziness, nausea and fatigue. Catching up on replies I noticed how we as long terms sick and disabled people are both well prepared for bad days and at the same time the trauma we had when we cope all this time remains.  :big_hugs:

It is so strange to me how anyone who is fit and healthy would think it is okay to say No to the vaccine. We have old wounds of being judged, shouted at or ignored by what seemed like all knowing medical staff having it can feel like saying No because we need to is going to be met with judgement and frowns. Being most at risk in so many ways and having to say No must be awful.

I am kind of rambling there is a point in there somewhere  :big_hugs:
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Sunny Clouds on 06 Jun 2021 08:09PM
I'm due to have my second jab tomorrow, Monday 7 June.

I'm grumbly over a fault in the database.  I got a text just over a week ago (on a Friday) inviting me to get an earlier appointment for my jab.  It had the date in the message American-style, saying I was booked in on 06/07/2021.  I checked my original text, and it  had the date British-style 07/06/21.  I phoned to make sure my booking is ok for the 7th and it was confirmed.

My starting supposition would be that texts like that are field-merge not individually typed, and if I'm right, there's a problem there with incompatible systems, and a serious possibility that a proportion of people not turning up for appointments have had what is for them the 'wrong' text message.

Of course, given how rubbish most of the expensively privately purchased schemes have been in the pandemic, that would be no surprise, but nor would it  be much of a surprise if they'd failed even after all this time to automate it , and have people typing dates into texts like that.  

I looked online and found that if I wanted to bring the appointment forward, I'd have to cancel my original appointment first.  That wasn't a risk I was prepared to take for the sake of the possibility of saving less than a week.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Fiz on 07 Jun 2021 07:03AM
Sounds like it was manually mistyped. Gosh totally assumed it was automated. 

It's unknown yet how long the vaccine protects you for. I'm expecting Covid to be a thing for a minimum of 2-3 years so I can see we'll be going round again with vaccines.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Sunny Clouds on 07 Jun 2021 09:51AM
Sounds like it was manually mistyped. Gosh totally assumed it was automated.
If it was mistyped, then it was only on a batch of 'come in early' texts, not on the main system because my phone call confirmed the original date (I didn't tell the call handler the correct date before he checked) and the reminder text was a British-style date.

But the book-earlier text, although from NHS booking, had a different style.  For instance, it had my name as well as the booking reference.  I even wonderd for a moment or two whether it could be some sort of scam, but it wasn't an email with a link that could be dodgy and although it mentioned a website, it was the official one.

That being said, as I type this, the fact that it mentioned my name does rather suggest that it was individually typed rather than field merge.  Even so, I still think there's a good chance it was typed by someone looking at a database.  How awful that my default supposition is that there's something wrong with the system when there may not be, just human error.

Normally, this sort of thing just makes me laugh at my own pettiness, it's just the potential for missed appointments that bugged me.  There'd be times (including some very zombied patches over the last few months) when I'd have simply thought "Aargh, I wrote the date wrong on my calendar, it's not next week, it's next month!" but not have got round to booking an 'earlier' appointment until after I'd missed my appointment.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Sunny Clouds on 07 Jun 2021 08:51PM
I had my second vaccine this afternoon.  I'm very tired but I don't think it's got anything to do with the vaccine as such.  I decided to walk to the centre, which took me about 40 min, but was mostly downhill.  I walked a little afterwards, caught a bus then another bus and did a bit of grocery shopping then walked home.  I've not been getting much exercise, so it wiped me out, but I've no excuse not to get more exercise now my ataxia's in remission.

Also, I didn't get much sleep last night, because I was fretting about stuff.  I only got about 4 hours sleep and I'm an 8 hours person, longer when low. Not long before leaving the house, I called the Sams and was on the phone for an hour, outpouring and trying, with the help of a lovely bloke who didn't presume to tell me what to do, to find more ways to feel positive.  But all that was nothing to do with the vaccine.

Then when I got to the centre, I hadn't put my hearing aids in.  As I explained to the lovely people there, without them, volume's a big problem, but with them, clarity's awful, especially if there's a lot of background noise.

The woman in reception told me to sanitise my hands.  I reached for my own gel in my pocket but she was insistent I should use theirs.  But it felt greasy/waxy and I panicked, wiping my hands down my trousers.  I tried to explain I'm obsessive compulsive and my reaction to it wasn't about the virus, it was a compulsive, knee-jerk "Feels greasy, eek, contaminated, must wash!"  I apologised for making a fuss and said how very grateful I am for them all making sure I get vaccinated.

Then was that horrid bit where they ask for an emergency contact number.  I panicked as I explained the only relative I have wouldn't be interested, he doesn't care about anyone except himself, as I had to accept after he made it clear to me this year.

They were all so lovely and kind and I'm terribly grateful.  In the midst of horridness, there's good stuff.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Fiz on 08 Jun 2021 06:34AM
I'm glad you have had your second vaccine sunny and if you had the Asda-Vinegar then I hope today goes okay as those that have a reaction tend to feel it most the following day. It's such a relief getting the second vaccine done, knowing you are well protected. Or will be in 3 weeks when it reaches its full effect.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Sunny Clouds on 08 Jun 2021 10:02AM
The vaccination centre was very efficient.  The only bit I didn't like was going in because they'd got a long zig-zag of barriers, which of course is a sensible way of doing things when it gets crowded, but there was only one other person there, and he came up really close behind me when I entered.

(I find that sort of thing stressful.  As I've pointedly said to a few men who have taken it to extremes, if I can't trust a man not to get close enough to me to pass on a deadly virus, I certainly don't trust him not to get close enough to knock me over or grope me.  I find that comment so much more effective than pre-pandemic world-weary looks or put-downs like "Is that the best you can do?  You must be desperate!")

But inside, there were swarms of helpers guiding people around.  One bloke was adjusting his manner to different people waiting in the last bit of the queuing system, and with me he sort of lightly danced and gestured where to go and so I made a show of lightly hopping into place, which cheered me up. 

I told him I nearly hadn't come.  I said that I'd read online that the vaccine is a plot to inflict some sort of high-tech thing on you, but when I had the first jab, my hopes of getting a smartphone were dashed and all I got was a free life-saving injection to protect me and those around me.

Which is also what I got this time.

Today, my only poorliness is more fatigue and tears from waking early fretting about stuff and trying to blot it out for hours with a puzzle book, so as yet no problems from the vaccine.  Except not getting a free radio mast to carry round with me.  :biggrin:

BTW, it was indeed the Asda-Vinegar.  I hadn't heard that  nickname for it before, and it's definitely added to my vocabulary for future use.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Fiz on 14 Sep 2021 02:49PM
It seems I am due a 3rd vaccine this winter. As it's to be 6 months from the second dose that means it'll be mid October onwards. My flu jab is October 4th though now they're saying the vaccines can be given together whereas before they'd recommended 2 weeks between them but with new vaccines evidence evolves plus the Pfizer isn't a mild form of the virus to provoke antibodies like the Asda-Vinegar is so I can't see any problem having the Pfizer and flu jabs together.


I have to say if I was the parent of a school aged teen I wouldn't be giving my teen the vaccine. Mostly as the effects/protection is only months and teens without underlying health conditions have strong immune systems. I think my son's partner will definitely be putting her teen forward for it probably as she was pretty unwell with Covid so knows first hand how ill people can be.


The government have said if numbers rise it may be working from home again. So many large organisations and civil servants still are!
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: lankou on 14 Sep 2021 04:08PM



I have to say if I was the parent of a school aged teen I wouldn't be giving my teen the vaccine.


Surely that is their decision to make.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Sunny Clouds on 14 Sep 2021 08:53PM
I think it varies a lot with the individual youngster  but I see it the way I see things like exercise for children.  If your child cycles or uses a skateboard or rides or climbs or whatever, there's a risk of injury, but if they don't, there's the physical and mental risks attached to not getting exercise and fresh air and fun.  So vaccines carry a risk, but it's relative risk.

I suppose the other thing that's very difficult to quantify is the matter of passing the virus on.  Even if you're vaccinated, you can pass it on, but it seems from what I've read that you're less likely to.  It's hard to get good statistics for that, though, because of symptomless covid.

I find the only a few months argument puzzling.  If I had a child and someone said "Your child's terribly good at cycling, so I don't suppose there's not much chance of injury if there's a careless motorist, but I can let you have a helmet for them.  I'm afraid you can only have it a few months, and it doesn't completely guarantee your child wouldn't get concussion if they get knocked off their bike, but it reduces the risk." I'd accept the offer of the helmet for a few months. 

That's set me musing, though, on what short term and longer-term forms of protection we do or don't use in our lives.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Fiz on 15 Sep 2021 07:58AM
My son and his partner had Covid, the partner pretty badly so I suspect with their being one bathroom and kitchen the teen probably had Covid despite no symptoms so probably has a level of immunity.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Fiz on 15 Sep 2021 09:20AM
As an aside, a friend has been waiting for spine surgery for many months, she's in intense pain and can do very little and is on very strong pain relief despite not being able to leave the house. She has had surgery cancelled 3 times in the last month due to lack of ICU beds, she has adrenal insufficiency so is a high risk patient and needs an ICU bed on standby though if she's stable she may go from theatre recovery to HCU. One of the cancellations was on the day and she'd got to the hospital. Each time she has been told that ICU is full mostly of unvaccinated patients with Covid. She's furious at people turning down the vaccines because people like her can't have their surgeries etc.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Sunny Clouds on 15 Sep 2021 12:47PM
Ah, but the unvaccinated community includes (but does not comprise solely of - people being individuals not stereotypes) people who don't believe the virus is real, sometimes even when they get it - if you're in ICU, you could still believe it's 'ordinary pneumonia'; people who don't believe you can develop a vaccination that fast; people who are led to disbelief by the conflict between those that say vaccines keep you alive and those that say you can be vaccinated but get covid, i.e. aren't being given a strong message that vaccines can reduce likelihood of getting it, and if you do, reduce the severity of it; people who have been conditioned by years of antivax propaganda; and people so jaded by years of dishonesty and cronyism and exploitation by powerful politicians, corporate interests etc. that they have stopped trusting that any new big event/situation that changes our lives isn't just one more ruse to control and/or exploit us.   Etc.

And that's the tip of the iceberg. I'm seething with fury over the rubbish communication people have had over all this.   I'm a nitpicker with a degree and postgrad qualifications from two different universities, and I've struggled with the convoluted mess of information.

I'm not justifying all the unvaccinated, just saying that I'm aware that there are many that think that not getting vaccinated isn't endangering others. 
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Fiz on 15 Sep 2021 02:36PM
Unlike my friend, I don't think the vaccine should be compulsory and I don't feel badly towards anyone who turns down their invitation to have it and value free choice. I don't like the misinformation that I read recently in posts by a friend of a friend which was complete twaddle from a clearly antivaxer but feel people should have the choice. Though I do support it being compulsory for frontline health care workers but sympathise with those that will lose job roles due to not wanting the vaccine. I wasn't sure about having another Covid vaccine but if it's the Pfizer which I trust then I probably will.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Sunny Clouds on 15 Sep 2021 04:05PM
I value free choice, but can think of quite a few job roles where vaccination against a range of diseases is or would be a reasonable requirement.

People don't seem to object to health professionals and soldiers etc. being expected to have certain other vaccinations. 

And likewise, broadly as a society we accept certain limitations on what people are permitted to do or where they're permitted to go based on what precautions they're prepared to take.  E.g. don't ride a motorbike without a helmet, don't drive if you've got epilepsy that's not been under control for a certain period of time (which for some drivers in effect means don't drive if you're not taking epilepsy medication) etc.  There's a whole range of jobs you wouldn't be allowed to do if you didn't cover up open wounds or skin with conditions that cause it to shed.

So I wouldn't object to vaccination being a requirement for a range of jobs, particularly those involving contact with others who don't have a choice whether to come into contact with you, such as police, prison warders, soldiers, health professionals in non-elective treatment areas, front line jobcentre staff, public transport workers not in a closed cab or booth etc.

I suppose one could allow for exemptions by turning the requirements upside down, as it were, and say that where I, as a member of the public, am required to do something or am entitled to do something, I am entitled to do it in a vaccine-protected environment once vaccines have been available to all, subject to  limited exceptions.

But then I'm a bit of a rebel in saying that I think that those that need care, be it elders or younger disabled people, and who get it in an institution, are entitled to expect that staff should have flu jabs and that if they don't, the resident should have the right to be moved to an institution where they are, at no cost to the resident.

Oh dear, bolshy me.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Sunny Clouds on 15 Sep 2021 04:39PM
More musings...

I suppose for me, there is a covid passport issue insofar as I don't like the fact that in some contexts they're being enmeshed in a modern NHS app system with facial recognition, with involvement of private companies.

I don't like what's happened in China and, to a lesser extent, in some other parts of the world, where your face enables you to be tightly tracked and monitored, and it's my understanding that not many countries in the world have as many CCTV cameras in public places as ours. 

So I find myself wondering how far my views on vaccine passports are coloured by my concept of them.  A vaccine passport as a printed item, perhaps with a photo on it, or with a name, address and also the reference number of a photo ID doesn't bother me in the same way.  Perhaps it should.  If the government is happy to let private companies have loads of NHS data, why wouldn't they let them have loads of passport data and driving licence data etc?  The government is pushing for mandatory voter ID, which in practice means intense pressure for every adult to have photo ID, probably in part via introducing a voter card or via introducing a photo NHS card.

Oh dear, so many tangled issues.  I believe in vaccinations, I want vaccinations, but the increasing passion by successive national governments in the UK for more and more ID and entwining of databases make this seem like just another way of deepening that, which isn't just something I don't like, it's something that seriously frightens me.

Oh well.  So much for my thinking my thoughts on this were clear.
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Sunny Clouds on 15 Sep 2021 05:08PM
Oh well, whilst I dither over whether we should or shouldn't expect others to have covid jabs, and if so, who, and whether or not they should have to prove it etc., I've had a text telling me my GP's got some flu jabs and to phone to book an appointment.  I phoned and was told just to drop in any time they're open.

So at least I can reduce my likelihood of dying from flu as well as reducing my likelihood of dying from covid.  Now can I have a vaccine against dangerous drivers?
Title: Re: Covid jab
Post by: Sunny Clouds on 16 Sep 2021 07:45PM
I've been flu jabbified and I'm very tired but I don't think it's actually the jab that's done it, just my usual go out, be active, come home, wilt thing.

Mind you, that was improving and it's worsened and I now think that a significant aspect is inadequate fluid, which would then leave me wilting if I get more exercise.

How easy it would be, though, having had a jab, to come home and attribute how I felt to that jab.  My bowels aren't very happy today, which I know is down to what I ate yesterday, but again, if I hadn't made the connection, how easy it would be to think the flu jab had upset my gut.

I'm not dismissing side-effects.  I'm aware that people can and do get side-effects from flu jabs.  I'm just musing on how I, and I assume (?) others, can find myself noticing things more if I've done something different.