Author Topic: Compulsory Coronavirus vaccinations in the care sector  (Read 392 times)

Fiz

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So, the government has decided to make all front line care workers have the vaccine unless medically advised not to. I can understand why, the virus is not going anywhere and frail and older residents are presenting in hospital now, very unwell, having had both vaccines themselves. So the government has decided to provide extra protection for them, so their carers should have the vaccines too. 

I do feel for people who have strong beliefs about the vaccines where redeployment isn't possible and they'll lose their jobs. I also feel for the already understaffed care sector who will lose staff because they don't want the vaccine. But overall, I think it is the right decision. Contraversial though for sure.

lankou

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Re: Compulsory Coronavirus vaccinations in the care sector
« Reply #1 on: 16 Jun 2021 08:19AM »

I do feel for people who have strong beliefs about the vaccines where redeployment isn't possible and they'll lose their jobs. I also feel for the already understaffed care sector who will lose staff because they don't want the vaccine. But overall, I think it is the right decision. Contraversial though for sure.
Several vaccinations already are compulsory for nurses/care staff.

Fiz

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Re: Compulsory Coronavirus vaccinations in the care sector
« Reply #2 on: 16 Jun 2021 10:26AM »
Yes Hep B. That underwent years of evidence based trials before being made compulsory though whereas due to necessity the Covid vaccines had very limited trials before being rolled out. Absolutely needed to happen and I've gratefully received my doses but I do also understand why some people would be wary, especially if pregnant, breastfeeding or trying for a baby because there's no data on impact on a foetus, baby etc but was approved for pregnant women and breastfeeding mothers in order to save lives. 

Bizarrely it's not yet compulsory for NHS workers to have the vaccine but care workers in residential homes will be soon. If that gets through, the NHS may well follow.

Sunny Clouds

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Re: Compulsory Coronavirus vaccinations in the care sector
« Reply #3 on: 16 Jun 2021 05:39PM »
I feel undecided.

I can see both sides of the argument.  Logically, given that people in care homes are typically vulnerable, then vaccination seems logical.  If someone can't be vaccinated, my gut feeling is that often (not always) that will be either that they are generally antivax, in which case I wonder what else they're anti that might affect residents, perhaps in relation to hygiene and treatments for illnesses; or that they are in some way immunosupressed, in which case the question is whether they should be working in a care home anyway. 

But I hesitate to lump together all that don't want to be vaccinated because there must be lots of logical reasons, for example, as Fiz points out, in relation to pregnancy & parenting.

Which leads me onto reasons for being wary.  I pick up on the mention of understaffing.  Caution - my political views affect my views on this.

I believe that understaffing right now is the tip of the iceberg.  For instance, there are a lot of European staff working in the care sector and post-Brexit rules are an obstacle to EU staff recruitment.  It may be that Priti Patel thinks an influx of Hong Kong refugees will make up for loss of European workers in various areas of employment but my gut feeling is that even if she's right, it will take time.

Of course, covid-19 has left many previously employed people out of work, but are they the people with the right attributes, talents and experience?  It remains to be seen.

Meanwhile large swathes of the care sector are already struggling financially because of asset-stripping, so paying extortionate rent on property they previously owned and other tricks of the asset strippers, leaves them with less money for staff, including money to pay decent wages and to train staff.

So I suppose the bottom line is the question of what the statistical overlap is between low-paid care home staff and not wanting to be vaccinated.

What a horrible situation.
(I'm an obsessive problem-solver, so feel free to ignore any suggestions or solutions I offer, even if they sound terribly insistent.)

Fiz

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Re: Compulsory Coronavirus vaccinations in the care sector
« Reply #4 on: 17 Jun 2021 08:30AM »
I'm unsure about it too. The fact that it is care home staff only at the moment and not NHS frontline staff doesn't make sense. The care sector is under enough strain as it is. That said, if I had a loved one in residential care, I would want their carers vaccinated to protect my loved one. But I wouldn't make them.

oldtone27

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Re: Compulsory Coronavirus vaccinations in the care sector
« Reply #5 on: 17 Jun 2021 09:15AM »
I suspect the government's ultimate aim is to include NHS workers but are going for an easier target fist. Care home workers are generally in less secure employment and don't have a great level of union support.

The NHS would be a much tougher nut to crack with unions and professional bodies to fight the staff's corner.

Having said all that I can see a strong case for all health workers to be fully vaccinated if in close contact with patients/clients.

Given the rather patchy vaccination take up in care then perhaps persuasion is not sufficient making compulsion the only option.

Fiz

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Re: Compulsory Coronavirus vaccinations in the care sector
« Reply #6 on: 18 Jun 2021 09:10AM »
I think you're absolutely right. I'm sure the NHS unions will have far less of a leg to stand on when care home workers have to have the vaccine. I haven't seen a backlash about it from care home workers so it appears they have accepted it.

KizzyKazaer

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Re: Compulsory Coronavirus vaccinations in the care sector
« Reply #7 on: 18 Jun 2021 06:11PM »
Talking of the unions, it really irritated me when someone interviewed on Radio 4's 'Today' suggested that there might be legal challenges relating to unvaccinated workers' human rights.  What about the human rights of the disabled and/or elderly people in care homes not to be put at unnecessary risk of catching a potentially deadly disease?

In general, I'm of the opinion that if there is no valid medical reason not to, everyone eligible should be offering up their arms for the jabs - it seems the right thing to do now.  I don't want to hear about religious objections - OK, they might be convinced that their chosen deity might protect them, but what about the rest of us?!  Just selfish. And as for those stupid conspiracy theories from some anti-vaxxers on the Internet - like, Bill Gates is using the vaccination programme to insert tracking devices or whatever into us :f_doh:  the tech companies should be shutting them down, one way or the other!

Sunny Clouds

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Re: Compulsory Coronavirus vaccinations in the care sector
« Reply #8 on: 18 Jun 2021 09:40PM »
I suppose the human rights issue is not so much specific to this vaccination but whether it sets precedents for what else the government might mandate.

That being said, I think this government has already stuck two fingers up at the democratic processes and human freedoms anyway, so I don't think this would be worse from a rights perspective.

On the other hand, I do think it's very likely to lead to even greater shortages in availability of affordable care and even (and I'm serious) more bankrupt local councils.

Why can't these things be simple?
(I'm an obsessive problem-solver, so feel free to ignore any suggestions or solutions I offer, even if they sound terribly insistent.)

oldtone27

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Re: Compulsory Coronavirus vaccinations in the care sector
« Reply #9 on: 19 Jun 2021 11:57AM »
Quote
Why can't these things be simple?
Human beings!

Sunny Clouds

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Re: Compulsory Coronavirus vaccinations in the care sector
« Reply #10 on: 19 Jun 2021 01:24PM »
Quote
Why can't these things be simple?
Human beings!
And there was me thinking it was politicians, not humans, that were the problem...


 :f_winkeye:
(I'm an obsessive problem-solver, so feel free to ignore any suggestions or solutions I offer, even if they sound terribly insistent.)